HR policy illegal?

My micromanaging manager just actually threatened us at our last pod meeting that she will be checking signatures. One before 9 and the last after 4. WTF? She stated our HR policy is to be in the field from 8-5pm and that does not include travel time. I live in a territory that is 4 hours long! If I did that, I would be leaving between 4-5 am and getting home at 8-9 pm. Then I would be expected to check my email and do what I needed to do for any admin on my own time. How in the hell do they expect us to really do this. Didn't other companies get sued over this? How long will it take to catch up with Sanofi? Hey Sanofi, you want to change the culture around here? How about being f'ing realistic? Seriously? Change this stupid policy before you get sued, or call off your something to prove, power drunk managers!

And BTW: For all you crazy CP posters, you can save your "if you don't like it leave" crap. If the company gets sued, (and they will eventually), we all suffer. Lawsuits are expensive, not to mention it is ridiculous and unrealistic. And you wonder why morale is low!?

Originally Posted by Anonymous

My micromanaging manager just actually threatened us at our last pod meeting that she will be checking signatures. One before 9 and the last after 4. WTF? She stated our HR policy is to be in the field from 8-5pm and that does not include travel time. I live in a territory that is 4 hours long! If I did that, I would be leaving between 4-5 am and getting home at 8-9 pm. Then I would be expected to check my email and do what I needed to do for any admin on my own time. How in the hell do they expect us to really do this. Didn't other companies get sued over this? How long will it take to catch up with Sanofi? Hey Sanofi, you want to change the culture around here? How about being f'ing realistic? Seriously? Change this stupid policy before you get sued, or call off your something to prove, power drunk managers!

And BTW: For all you crazy CP posters, you can save your "if you don't like it leave" crap. If the company gets sued, (and they will eventually), we all suffer. Lawsuits are expensive, not to mention it is ridiculous and unrealistic. And you wonder why morale is low!?

That's a very demotivating approach and threatening to check signatures doesn't accomplish anything. The field operations policy doesn't require signatures before or after a specified time. The policy of course does require being in the field from 8-5pm. As far as the drive time part, that's where HR would advise the manager to accomodate what's reasonable for the rep to manage the territory.

The manager is attempting to address an individual performance issue and doesn't have the skills to handle 1:1 with the rep (one rep not putting a good faith effort into working full-time). Or, manager thinks this is a way to increase productivity (sad, but that's how some managers think).

Pushing something like that on everyone isn't going to accomplish anything other than worsen the trust issues most likely already affecting the team. If there is a performance issue with someone (or more than one rep) then that should be addressed but not through something like asking for sample signatures.

Good luck. Coming from a manager that's a terrible way to lead.

Originally Posted by Anonymous

My micromanaging manager just actually threatened us at our last pod meeting that she will be checking signatures. One before 9 and the last after 4. WTF? She stated our HR policy is to be in the field from 8-5pm and that does not include travel time. I live in a territory that is 4 hours long! If I did that, I would be leaving between 4-5 am and getting home at 8-9 pm. Then I would be expected to check my email and do what I needed to do for any admin on my own time. How in the hell do they expect us to really do this. Didn't other companies get sued over this? How long will it take to catch up with Sanofi? Hey Sanofi, you want to change the culture around here? How about being f'ing realistic? Seriously? Change this stupid policy before you get sued, or call off your something to prove, power drunk managers!

And BTW: For all you crazy CP posters, you can save your "if you don't like it leave" crap. If the company gets sued, (and they will eventually), we all suffer. Lawsuits are expensive, not to mention it is ridiculous and unrealistic. And you wonder why morale is low!?

You must be new. That has been the policy all along and is standard for most pharma. It comes down to how much your manager trust you and how tightly they enforce it. The question is why? Are your district sales sucking? Good luck with a lawsuit. At will employment. "if you don't like it leave".

sounds like an idiotic manager. if there is a performance issue, i can understand that but to be checking it on a regular basis is insane. no trust obviously or she is trying to move people out so she can bring in her own team. good luck with that one since sa is constantly on a hiring freeze. in the bigger picture, all of these recent overtime lawsuits are double edged swords. sure they protect the reps from the types of environment being described in this post. however when sa does get sued for it and loses, reps will be punching time clocks at that point. be careful what you wish for.

This is completely understandable that you would be upset at your manager's request. How else will you be able to get your child on the school bus unless you're home before 9 a.m.?

Oh, by the way, any signature before 9 and after 4 will be collated and made into a report that is taken into the field to doctors' offices where the physician has to verify that is his/her signature.

Get the picture?

well all i can to OP is that if you sell Lantus & Apidra, we don't have remotely enough samples to be taking sample orders every day so a signature before 9 & after 4 is just not possible! Your quarterly sample alottment will be gone way too quickly into the quarter, leaving you with no samples for rest of quarter! Most of us in diabetes place no more than 1, maybe 2 orders, A DAY....making the most of the sample allocations they give us! GOOD LUCK

just have a stash of paper signature and trace it...work smart

Originally Posted by Anonymous

My micromanaging manager just actually threatened us at our last pod meeting that she will be checking signatures. One before 9 and the last after 4. WTF? She stated our HR policy is to be in the field from 8-5pm and that does not include travel time. I live in a territory that is 4 hours long! If I did that, I would be leaving between 4-5 am and getting home at 8-9 pm. Then I would be expected to check my email and do what I needed to do for any admin on my own time. How in the hell do they expect us to really do this. Didn't other companies get sued over this? How long will it take to catch up with Sanofi? Hey Sanofi, you want to change the culture around here? How about being f'ing realistic? Seriously? Change this stupid policy before you get sued, or call off your something to prove, power drunk managers!

And BTW: For all you crazy CP posters, you can save your "if you don't like it leave" crap. If the company gets sued, (and they will eventually), we all suffer. Lawsuits are expensive, not to mention it is ridiculous and unrealistic. And you wonder why morale is low!?

Your manager is an ahole. I would repoet her to HR now!!!!!

Originally Posted by Anonymous

Your manager is an ahole. I would repoet her to HR now!!!!!

initials BW?

more POD meetings please

Originally Posted by Anonymous

My micromanaging manager just actually threatened us at our last pod meeting that she will be checking signatures. One before 9 and the last after 4. WTF? She stated our HR policy is to be in the field from 8-5pm and that does not include travel time. I live in a territory that is 4 hours long! If I did that, I would be leaving between 4-5 am and getting home at 8-9 pm. Then I would be expected to check my email and do what I needed to do for any admin on my own time. How in the hell do they expect us to really do this. Didn't other companies get sued over this? How long will it take to catch up with Sanofi? Hey Sanofi, you want to change the culture around here? How about being f'ing realistic? Seriously? Change this stupid policy before you get sued, or call off your something to prove, power drunk managers!

And BTW: For all you crazy CP posters, you can save your "if you don't like it leave" crap. If the company gets sued, (and they will eventually), we all suffer. Lawsuits are expensive, not to mention it is ridiculous and unrealistic. And you wonder why morale is low!?

Manager here. I am sick of tired of ALL of us getting grouped into a group with the moron you work for. LET PEOPLE THINK AND DO THEIR JOB AND YOU WILL BE SHOCKED BY THE RESULTS.

Here is your advice from me: Do your job, if you don't get a signature prior to the time necessary or after the time necessary, don't worry about it. When your manager brings this to your attention, ask to see the policy that mandates that a "signature" be achieved prior/after said times. As they backpedal, ask if you can get the Human Resources Partner involved to clarify the "policy" they are using.

Worried about retaliation at your midyear/year end? Of course you are! Simple, remember, you brought HR in and AS long as you are doing your job, they give you a bad review, you have your retaliation right there! (Trust me, managers do NOT have the power you think they do)

Remember, fear tactics come from incompetent, insecure managers who want you to be them, not you. Hang in there and feel free to ask any other questions. I have no problem helping anyone else through stuff.

But, I understand how frustrating bad managers can be.

Originally Posted by Anonymous

Manager here. I am sick of tired of ALL of us getting grouped into a group with the moron you work for. LET PEOPLE THINK AND DO THEIR JOB AND YOU WILL BE SHOCKED BY THE RESULTS.

Here is your advice from me: Do your job, if you don't get a signature prior to the time necessary or after the time necessary, don't worry about it. When your manager brings this to your attention, ask to see the policy that mandates that a "signature" be achieved prior/after said times. As they backpedal, ask if you can get the Human Resources Partner involved to clarify the "policy" they are using.

Worried about retaliation at your midyear/year end? Of course you are! Simple, remember, you brought HR in and AS long as you are doing your job, they give you a bad review, you have your retaliation right there! (Trust me, managers do NOT have the power you think they do)

Remember, fear tactics come from incompetent, insecure managers who want you to be them, not you. Hang in there and feel free to ask any other questions. I have no problem helping anyone else through stuff.

But, I understand how frustrating bad managers can be.

Where in the country are you a manager? I hope your reps know how lucky they are because you are a rarity at Sanofi.

Originally Posted by Anonymous

Where in the country are you a manager? I hope your reps know how lucky they are because you are a rarity at Sanofi.

Thank you! I know I am the rarity. Remember guys, I work with managers just as close as with my sales professionals. You don't think some of us managers look at those other managers and laugh? If we had a choice, we would not want to work with them either. However, there is no feedback mechanism in place. Remember in college you had group courses where you had to grade your partners? Well, sometimes I wish we had this here as well.

Hang in there and if you need anything else, just post it and I will give you the best answer.

I will make this caveat though. I'm not a dummy, sometimes managers do these things because sales professionals do STUPID things that force our hand to be this way. The problem is that EVERYONE ends up paying. We all know sales people who screw the system and chances are, the manager got screwed one time. Keep that in the back of your mind as well.

Bravo to the manager that gave us great and helpful advice. You are one to be treasured. If only more. Maybe what the manager team can do is what reps do. Sit that "bad apple" down at a meeting and coach them. Let see if they can change, oops develop their skill base.

Sounds like the manager with the good advice doesn't think HR isn't being led by an inexpt director.