Training Dept. in a Death Spiral

Discussion in 'Procter & Gamble' started by Anonymous, Aug 30, 2007 at 7:13 AM.

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  1. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    If the future depends on the young people who are being hired today, we are in BIG trouble. No qualifications, they can not pass the tests (we must dumb them down or have a manager sit next to them and tell them the answers so they can “pass”). Couple this with a training dept. that is so inept that they can not get these people into the field for months and months, putting the pressure for calls on the rest of the force.
     

  2. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Blame the managers who are hiring them. Maybe we should look for individuals with experience in the industry, with a healthcare background or if they just graduated college...someone with a biology or some type of science degree. Hiring a cheerleader major just won't cut it.
     
  3. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    I see new hires sitting and home month after month and it never ends. This causes resentment on the team. And when the team discovers just how unqualified these people are, the resentment escalates.
     
  4. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    I couldn't agree more! Maybe the want to hire dumb people so they won't question management.
     
  5. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    In all likelihood,the hiring of more and more unqualified reps, who probably wouldn't have even received an interview in past years, and the decreasing emphasis on training means that PGP mgmt understands that their division will soon be history. PGP mgmt knows the handwriting is on the wall and that without new major drugs to offset the future increasing lost of profits from Actonel and Asacol, PGP has no real future. In fact, the question that arises now is if PGP were to actually get a major drug or two to sale, who is going to sell them? As senior experienced reps are forced out or leave and are replaced with Ken and Barbie reps who are unqualified with no selling skills and receive minimal training, how can anyone be optimistic about the future of PGP?
     
  6. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    You are so right! If we had a new drug tomorrow, I am not sure we would have a force that could sell it, definitely not if it required selling from a reprint or required more than a 60 second sound bite. They have disrespected the few managers and reps. who are left who still know how to do this job. Sometimes I think they run the Rx division out of the back of a pick-up.
     
  7. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Can you imagine the disaster when a physician asks one of the new reps a difficult question? They will most likely short circuit and start repeating the 4c message in a continuous loop. The doctor's opinion that all reps are idiots will be confirmed, reps won't be allowed in the clinic anymore, then management will demand that we add more reps.

    Does anyone remember the quaint little term, "the art of selling"?
     
  8. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    This message hits a tender spot for me, as my MKS is stellar, yet, I am being forced to talk to my Drs. like a simpleton. You would think that someone would say to the reps. with great MKS and more than a few years, that they should keep doing what they are doing!!!!!! But, no – management thinks that they should control every word that comes from out mouths. Now I understand the need to give a short message most of the time, and yes, it needs to have structure, but if you are talking to a specialist, they are not talking time for you to hear a kindergarten message. And I know that the company does not believe it, but some of us actually know what the hell we are doing out here.
     
  9. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    I blame much of this on the kind of people who have been promoted lately. They have promoted the kiss ups and not the people who really know what needs to be done and are good at their jobs. There is a great article on this in the current Harvard Business Review. It talks about how businesses promote based on the individuals ability to network and not on their skills. It does not take long before you end up with a group of people leading an organization who are so deficient in management abilities that the mistakes are staggering.
     
  10. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    I am a seasoned rep that was forced out by the powers (HR) and an idiot "new DM". She couldn't manager her way out of a wet paper bag. I came to CP to voice my concerns and let others in on the BS that is moving thru a once good company that now has gone bad. I am thrilled to see more people come here and voice other issues as well. In the past there was a certain code of silence at P&G and negative issues were not disscussed, but this is our livelihood here and the extremely poor business decisions being made by pharma upper manangent will have a negative impact on everyone. I am also impressed by the thoughtful comentary and level headed posts, very high quality by CP standards. I have moved on and ultimately got all I needed from P&GP, but I am so glad that those of you still with the company are coming here to raise awareness. It will help others in pharma make better decisions for their own familys and careers.

    P.S. I my opinion the training dept has always been a complete waste. C. Cahill-What an idiot. He "attempted" to teach using the Socratic method, I assume because physicians are taught that way. PLEASE!!!Spare me. Sales people are motivatied via POSITIVE reinforcement.
     
  11. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Think about this: Collectively, the reps who have been recently promoted to the training department (Rob from Texas, the woman from L.A, & the guy from Michigan) have LESS THAN 5 YEARS PHARMA experience. Nothing against them personally, I've only met Rob, but how can you train new reps if you haven't actually been out there in the trenches carrying the bag for at least 3 years??? Doesn't really make much business sense.
     
  12. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Several of you on this post are right on target. The top salary range for Band I Sales Representatives USED to be ~$120-$125M. P&GP knows that representatives in the territory with the most tenure (usually the 3 year mark) deliver the best business results and there needs to be an economic incentive to stay in the role for the long term. Let's face, in CBD, only 4% of the organization is at Band IV or above. Not exactly a pyramid organization.

    That being said, with the new structure rolled out in June, the TOP of the new salary curve for Band I Sales Representatives is around ~$112M. But, the Band II Manager curve has been substantially increased to around ~$140M at the top. This had to be done b/c there was very little incentive for a representative to take on more responsibility to a Band II manager b/c often times representatives on a managers team would make more than the manager, which is counterproductive.

    Saddest part of all, is Rich Schiano (why use RS we all know who we're talking about), has recommended to new managers at the meetings in June to hire "social workers and teachers because they are used to working long hours and not making much money." What a disappointment eh? So much for the "best and the brightest" speech he gives to the New Hires in Cincy.

    MBC HR Insider
     
  13. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Interesting about how little experience the new people in the training dept. have. But then, if you are only teaching new hires to say simple messages without any true interaction with Drs., then I guess it just does not matter. All they are really doing is training sample droppers. They are not being trained to drive MKS, because they will never be able to do that.
     
  14. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    As a new Rep who is tired of reading postings from "experienced reps" complaining about how unqualified we are...please keep in mind that we were hired because you "experienced reps" weren't providing results. They may be telling you that the company is "restructuring" but it doesn't take a genius to figure out that if the job was getting done before we wouldn't be here. To add to that, if you are so unhappy with your job and employer, quit bitching and find another job.
     
  15. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    You were hired because you will work for less money and because the skills needed today are minimal vs. what was required a few yrs. ago. Yes, the current changes will take out some of the more skilled reps., but not because they were/are not doing the job, but because the mgt needs to reduce the overall cost of people. This is a companywide directive and you will see this happening in other areas as well. So, that is why you and others like you have been hired. But do not think for a moment that mgt is not terrified about the talent they see walking out the door. Now, as to why some of us stay......I can see that it will become harder and harder to stay now that the company is hiring people who are an embarrassment. As the job market opens up, the best will move on and will be your competition.
     
  16. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    It is a fact that PGP is cutting it's sales rep overhead by hiring new sales reps at far less moneywise then current reps are making. They have also combined a number of territories so there has been some slight downsizing in reps.

    The very bad situation that PGP now faces is because of exceedingly poor decisions from upper mgmt in the past 5-10 years. Fortunately, PGP has had solid contributions from it's sales force in past years, but in the past few years a number of "experienced reps" have left for greener pastures or been forced out. The result is that PGP now has an increasing number of new inexperienced reps who couldn't have gotten an interview with PGP 5 years ago. You may be the exception......but, others have witnessed first hand and up close the utter incompetence of many new reps.

    Another fact that you may not like.....PGP, the RX division, of P&G is on extremely shakey ground. The evidence is now virtually overwhelming.....P&G will soon pull the plug on PGP....likely within the next 1-2 years if not sooner.
    Instead, P&G will focus on promoting OTC Healthcare products. I'm afraid you will soon learn that the restructuring is not because "experienced rep" weren't providing results, but rather, because P&G is positioning itself to leave RX drugs.
     
  17. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Amen to that-upper management has totally screwed the pooch.
     
  18. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    It is now clear that reps. are being hired with one and only one requirement – they work cheep. But this does not just apply to the new hires. It also can be seen in the new managers. People are moving into management that would not have had a chance a few yrs ago. When both facts are added up, it leaves only one conclusion. That is that they do not want or need highly skilled people for the future.
     
  19. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    once again if you are so unhappy with the company and the direction its going quit bitching and find a new job. Although the people who are posting to this website will be unhappy regardless of where the work. They just like to complain. As far as the new hires being cheap labor... I know for a fact they are not that far off from the rest of you. Finally, in regards to the pharma side of p&g going away in a year or two...get over it that's just corporate America. But then if your career has been limited to pharma you wouldnt know that.
     
  20. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Your comments are amazing.....you come onto the P&G board as a new rep and make uninformed and insulting comments about long time PGP reps. This is a PGP board for discussion and a number of PGP reps, who have worked long and hard for PGP, are simply expressing their deep concerns as to the direction and future of the company. Your make comments saying that reps posting their concerns should quit bitching and find a new job where they will be unhappy there as well.....you also state that experienced reps were replaced because they weren't producing results.......well, who in the hell are you, as a new rep, to make those kinds of insulting comments! You know nothing about the reps posting here, PGP or pharmaceuticals! Lastly, your telling reps with families that have invested many years with PGP that they "should just get over it" because it's just corporate America is a heartless and ridiculous statement. My only wish is that you would have taken your "know it all attitude" to another pharmaceutical company!