PharmD's are not doctors!

Discussion in 'MSL Board' started by Anonymous, Sep 11, 2007 at 2:00 AM.

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  1. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    The PharmD degree is a professional doctorate much like an MD, but the difference is that the PharmD is the equivalent of obtaining Master's degree.

    Further, pharmD's cannot treat or diagnose, they can only recommend a medication therapy to a provider, including MD's, DO's, PA's and NP's. It's funny PA's and NP's do not possess doctorate titles but have undergone the same number of years in education?

    Further, PharmD's cannot manage a disease, it is absurd that they run the pharmaceutical industry. Pharmacologists, PhD's yes, definately, but Pharmacists? It is a useless degree with little value. MD or DO is the best for the MSL job, and I'd take a PA or NP over a PharmD any day--they're better prepared for disease management which entails pharmaceuticals.

    As for PharmD's see below:

    "For the last 15 or 20 years," says John D. Wiley, chancellor of the University of Wisconsin at Madison, "we've been under pressure to take what is basically a master's degree and call it a doctorate."
     

  2. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    sure...a nurse is just good enough to wipe my butt
     
  3. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Outside of industry PharmD's have no power or authority besides filling prescriptions. A nurse may be good enough to wipe your butt, let's not forget they're kind enough to do so as well. If and when you're really sick or a family member (parent or grand-parent) is really sick, you look to your doctor for guidance and a nurse for support and never does a pharmacist play role in that equation. Sorry for your disgruntled response noted above, obviously you have little understanding of healthcare roles other than your own.
     
  4. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    A PharmD's clinical experience usually includes getting puked on and you can get a PharmD degree out of a gumball machine now.
     
  5. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Just what we need: more catty nurses in industry. The great memorizers and process creators have dumb downed the role. Go back to the floor, Nurse Ratchet.
     
  6. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Sorry to cross post but this was off topic in the original thread and belongs here:

    Why is it a PharmD instead of a PharmMS? Last time I checked when you add a year or two to a bachelors degree it is a masters not a doctorate. Sure when it was first developed there was suppost to be a research component (again like a masters thesis not a doctoral disertation). But most PharmD programs have done away with the research piece if they even had it.

    Just curious. There was a good article on this in the Chronicles of Higher Ed:

    http://chronicle.com/free/v53/i42/42a01001.htm
     
  7. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    So does that mean a DDS is not a doctoral degree either? Or an opthamology doctorate? How about podiatry? Hell- even a lawyer gets a JD in six years of education.

    A PhD is a nice degree, but I dont get why playing with endothelial cells in a petri dish qualifies you to discuss the details of drug therapy.
     
  8. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    The PharmD program is 4 years now. You don't have to get a bachelors first, you just have to complete the pre-pharmacy requirements which are about 2 years worth. After that, you go to pharmacy school for 4 years.
     
  9. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Who said anything about RN's? It was PA's and NP's, both of which can diagnose, manage and treat disease (even hang their own shingle if they so desire, we'll NPs at any rate). Dumb down the profession, please.... we all know that there are good and bad in any profession and segment of healthcare.. We've all encountered the foreign medical school grad who's now in residency learning english and medicine; or the nurse who doesn't want to do anything extra for the patient. I believe the only point to this whole board is that PharmD is a just a master's degree, but the pharmacy association lobbied to give it a doctorate title. In addition, JD's are not called doctors, it is not proper etiquette. Soon everyone in healthcare will wish to be called DOCTOR, further confusing the patients. The question is who is the doctor or clinician making the decisions for the patient, it is not a PHARMACIST.
     
  10. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    This is all rubbish. I am a PharmD and it is NO better than a pharmacist with a diploma added to the RPh!!

    The ONLY reason that the industry wants PharmD's in this role is SIMPLY because the PharmD's have got into MSL positions of power..and they are MANDATING from HR to HIRE PharmD's...THATS IT FOLKS!!!!

    Patient care if taken care of by PHYSICIANS and NURSES..PERIOD

     
  11. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    ....and its quite sad that many patients are being taken care of by PA's and NP's, people who generally don't have a clue about the drugs their prescribing...
     
  12. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    ...with one, maybe two, semesters of pharmacology....
     
  13. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Gotta love those PharmDs.....so full of themselves.

    The old PharmD had some meat ot it. The new ones are nothing more than pill pushers.

    The comment about how they've infected the MSL role is 100% correct.

    They are such a joke!!
     
  14. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    1st point: I have never heard of a JD calling themselves doctor.
    2nd point: We call the people messing with the petri dishes lab tech (sometimes Dr. Lab Tech). We call the people who understand the science, are creating new knowledge and are Professors of science and medicine Doctor (latin for teacher) and give them the PhD distinction.
     
  15. Peacemaker

    Peacemaker Guest

    wow, such bitterness! 2 semesters thank you, but we (PA's and NP's) all learn by experience, as do the MD's. The more patients and experience one has at treating or managing diseases the more the science is understood. How many drugs have they prescribed? How many chest X-rays or CT's have you reviewed; how many stitches have you sewn; probably none, but if someone took the time to train you, you'd get learn the skill or art and improve with experience.

    Further, if you have a personal issue with the function of PA's or NP's, take it up with the various state boards (medical board for PA's and nursing board for NP's) and petition to revoke their prescriptive authority and DEA #. Oh yeah, also petition CMA, and the DEA as well. Then I suggest, you lobby for prescriptive authority with the various Pharmacy boards, but that would require a change in the curriculum in pharmacy school.

    Pharmacists have their place and their role in healthcare, it seems to be in patient care specialities like transplant or HIV, where they give advice to physicians or the provider; or they can work in retail pharmacies doing the dreaded job of filling prescriptions; or there's also industry and managed care. Pharmacists do have a hold on industry, but I suspect that will change and evolve as well, as reimbursement continues to decline for MD's more may look to move out of patient care. Lastly, don't be so disgruntled about PA's and NP's they will be the first line of entry in to healthcare sooner than you might believe. Right out of school we're green, but so is everyone, give them 3-5 years, their as good as the MD and besides patients like us!
     
  16. Peacemaker

    Peacemaker Guest

    Oh yeah, nurses have been able to be trained to perform and administer anesthesia successfully for over 40 years so don't think for a minute that nurses do not understand the science of what their doing!
     
  17. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest


    Since I have a PPO plan, I choose to have my anesthesia done by an MD. Say what you want, but RN CNA can just treat all the illegal aliens and the HMO members.
     
  18. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    I have both degrees (PharmD/PhD), and I will use my two earned doctoral titles whenever I damned well please. I earned both of them and you are hardly in a position to dictate who is called "doctor" and who is not.

    In academic hierarchy, the PhD is the highest degree that can be earned. MDs rank below Master's degrees of any type, and barely are qualified to be called "doctor" (latin root "ducere" = "to lead") based on the standards of academic degree levels in the United States. The hierarchy is very simple:
    PhD-level (may include Doctor of Arts, Doctor of Theology); master's degrees (MS, MA, MBA, MN, MPharm, etc.); professional doctorates (MD, DO, DDS/DMD, OD (optometry), etc.); bachelor's degrees; then associate's degrees. MDs are the middle of the pack. If you anger needs to be directed, I suggest you remember THEY are the ones who keep calling us PhD's "not real doctors". 'Scuse me, but then what the hell my graduate school make me wear that stupid mortarboard and that damned ridiculous bell-sleeved commencement gown for so many years ago? What a bunch of OCD assholes about a damned title...

    Crawl down off the cross because somebody needs the wood. So you are not called "doctor". Who really gives a flying hoot? There are bachelor's level graduates who do a better job of explaining scientific and clinical data than the vast majority of health care professionals. You don't hear them whining about their titles, but you seem to be pre-occupied with them.

    Get over yourself and either earn a doctoral title or resign yourself to never being an MSL in a doctorate-dominated area of industry.
     
  19. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest


    Hey there, you are a doctor, you have a PhD! I have no issue with you being called a doctor. I don't really care if PharmD's call themselves doctor, except that in some states, if you decide to call yourself doctor, you have to clarify, that you're a doctor of pharmacy. It just seems the the RPH was just given a fancier title out there of PharmD, with little added to the didactic component of the degree. You are mistaken or I have misled you, if you think I have an issue with titles? I don't! I am well aware of well-qualified and scientific people with a variety of degrees and backgrounds. It just is sometimes nauseating at times to work with self-aggrandizing PharmD's. Some of the PharmD's are worth their weight in gold, however others....well enough said.
     
  20. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Get over it already. There are acceptable and unacceptable attitudes from professionals in every discipline. Instead of pointing the finger, maybe it is time to look at the 3 pointing back at you.