Help-being pushed out before 90 days!!!!

Discussion in 'Home Healthcare Reps - General Discussion' started by Anonymous, Dec 17, 2011 at 2:59 PM.

Tags: Add Tags
  1. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest


    I am a victim of a pharma division shutting down. So, I was laid off 9 months. I have always been in top 5 or 10%. I have done other sales as well. I got hired by lets say, ABC Home Health (a bigger one) in October. My 90 day probation period is up in January. I was put in a new territory, and have already started getting referrals the first 30 days. They want 10 (lots of competition here) so they do know it takes time to build relationships first. I forgot to say I was with another home health for 6 months before this one and did quiite well, but I had a medical director who I was always with to get me referrals. I do not have him anymore obviously as he is with last company. There are 2 other reps with my current company- one here a year and one here 9 months. The latter took 4 months to get ANY referrals. She just got 5 last month. The other averages about 6... so, they have fired nurses and PT's as our "census" needs to be up. Well, all of a sudden, my driving sucks (rode with a supervisor and a rep and we had zero driving incidents). I did get called on by a citizen (as has everyone..some several times) because someone cut me off, I had to slam my brakes and car behind almost hit me. One of them called in. What can you do when your company name and fleet number is blazened all over your car? No atta boys for accessing hospitals and very important accounts in just 60 days, no kudos for referrals I have gotten, all I get is, I need to wear turtlenecks (I have been blessed) with my suits- very discriminatory... I dress in very good taste and as a pharma rep not once did a manager complain of my driving or my attire. ( I do not show my girls!) my ipad and phone quit receiving emails over the weekend and so on a Monday, before I even had a chance to see they were not working, I got chewed out for not having a working phone and computer! What?I It was working Friday at 5! So I called the IT people right away, it was a glitch on their end and voila fixed. So, I am apparently bad at calling to get it fixed, but hard to know it is not working when we do not usually receive any emails on the weekend, so until someone called to find out why I did not respond, how can I know? Then, I was shown "briefly" how to do a very complicated, time consuming expense report. I learn by doing it hands on. So first expense report, I was on my own and I made some easily fixed mistakes. Instead of "it's okay" it is something we all have to learn, it was "what was wrong with you?" Did you not pay attention when she showed you in less than 5 minutes how to do it? Geez! I had formal traiing at pharma co where we had dummy reports we did hands on. I still made mistakes on first one but no one yelled at me. I am now putting 2 and 2 together. I have received zero support. I am very positive and have been very confused as to why no one (especially if they have a problem with me) wants to help me do my job better. I think I am doing fine, especially for 2 months. I know they fired staff already for over hiring. This company has been around for years but only 1.5 years in this city. So there is no brand recognition. it is hard as I have 900 agencies in my territory. The other 2 reps have medical directors, and that is where almost all their referrals come from. I have no medical director, and trying to find one, with no help from my boss. she acts like she even cares if I get one. I have known this lady for my whole life. She is good friends with my Mom. That is one reason I got hired (also because of my very successful record) I cannot beleive how she is treating me when she has close ties to my family. So, my 90 days is up after Christmas. I suspect she is trying to find any little thing to write me up over to have documentation to get rid of me. I don't think it is because she doesn't like me. I think it is because they cannot pay me, (once again... census is lowest of all 20 branches) so she is making it personal to be able to cut ties. What recourse do I have? I am a single parent with no other support. If I get let go for "performance" or inability to do job" (which they are very aware I am doing both... just nitpicking) what do I do? Do I get unemployment? I think I am being very unfairly treated. Especially when other 2 reps did their expense reports on wrong days, didn't do PTO's right on Thanksgiving, have both been called on for driving (as has the clinic coordinator more than a few times). The director of ops pretends to go "marketing" so he can leave office for hours at a time and has no clue or answer to any of my questions. His job is not to market. He hasn't brought in a single referral and we all know he is full of crap. Why is his job not in trouble? It is really unfair. My boss told me last week "it looks like you know how to do your job" (just had a great lunch at a big hospital) no good job, etc. she told me to fix my boots (what?- change my dress- once again very professional) and said there were complaints on my driving. Hmmmm . I bet if I brought that up to supposed person I 'drove" with they would have a surprised look on their face. I drive carefully, especially with company name on car, and especially with a rep in car! Should I document everything? I have never worked in a hostile environment before. Just because they may shut down our branch in the future doesn't mean they have to be nasty to try and trip me up and get rid of me. They also told me I would lose my car if one more incident. I guess it is okay with everyone else (including one of the top directors) being called on. There are mean people who are unhappy that will call. No one else i know of has been threatened to have car taken away. I am so stressed. Merry Christmas to me. If anyone has an answer it will be greatly appreciated. I am super scared for me and my little girls.
  2. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Paragraphs are wonderful things.
  3. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    poster 2 if you have nothing nice to say then don't say anything. Silence is also a "wonderful" thing. I doubt anyone cares too much about grammar on here. Go back to your English class now!
  4. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Just find another job. It is obvious your experience is not appreciated. There are many home health agencies out there. Go where you are appreciated.
  5. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    I work for Gentiva and also came from pharma. Have been there a short time. They are also trying to fire me. I get no support. Zero positive feed back. I am making goal. But it is not good enough. My branch is also full of nasty people. My boss has an agenda. She gets pissed off when I have a good day during a ride along and trivalizes my gains. She has someone in mind for my job. An internal candidate who is being downsized. (Rumor has it) They are meeting for lunch. My boss never eats lunch. Interesting. I know that I am worth more than this place has to offer. I will hold my head up high and challege her on her BS. I was an award winning rep in big pharma in a company. I can't wait to be let go. Unemployment and this spring off. Bring it on!!!! In the mean time I will keep looking. Do yourself a favor, get out also. This job is beneath you. I am sorry we are both having problems. I am sure you are a very nice person. I know I am. But these greedy Medicare $ sucking A-Holes don't give a rats hinney about any thing or one.
    Know your worth!!!!
  6. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Just dont jump from the frying pan and into the fire and go to work for Amedisys.
  7. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Okay, here goes: You may not like what I have to say to you former Pharma girls, but it's the truth. HH sales is akin to "used car salespeople" in the world of healthcare sales. Y'all are at the bottom of the barrel so to speak. They don't give a rat's ass about your pharma experience, and most likely, look upon you with envy for your prior exp. and pay/bennies. Do NOT act haughty or superior in any way at work...or, they will go out of their way to make it harder for you. Most HH's offer virtually zero formal training, unlike pharma, and it is learn as you go. Also, you BETTER have close, personal friends who are physicians to send you referrals every month bc you are now in an extremely "local" political climate within the industry. Each town, city, etc. is different unlike pharma where you have rules, guidelines, etc. Some HH reps and cos. "pay to play" even though it's illegal. While others own the HH, yet ownership is "hidden" so to speak. Very slimy industry and unprofessional people. But, it's money until you find a better gig. Hell, if you work it right, you can work 3 days a week and still make your quota! And, to the rep that her boss is her mom's friend...some friend huh? I would talk to your mom about it...seriously. Also, a competing rep could be the one calling and reporting you...Good luck to both of you and hang in there! Use this as a paid job search!!!
  8. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    thanks for insight. I do not act "haughty" at all but I do not like been treated like a piece of trash when I am used to working for big classy corporations. This really is the bottom of the barrel.. very unethical. You are right... I do have many doctor friends... problem is ... they are mostly medical directors already! The others think doing referrals for HH is a big pain in the a....s...! So they would not like to do the CPO, keep signing 485, F2F... etc... it is so unethical...and you know... didn't think about another rep calling and "reporting" me,when I drive just fine... I love the fleet numbers on our cars (and the company logo) this place is insane~oh, and I did make the 90 days.. I was supposed to meet quota the first month tho...
  9. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Poster # 7 is right on. I came to Gentiva from big pharma and have twice the experience of most sales management. And forget the operations people at the branch level...very unprofessional and jealous of anyone with success or God forbid a formal education. The VP of Operations is rarely at her branches and has her head so deep in the sand she doesn't see any of the multitude of problems. All HH is like this...its like working at a used car lot. Work your butt off to make your goal in 3 days and keep looking.
  10. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Just left a brief stint in home health after six years in pharma and not finding a lot of opportunities there. Stay away.

    It's a pretty sleazy business. Eventually you start to feel like an ambulance chaser. Some companies are ethical, most are not. You have competitors that flat out bribe discharge planners for referrals, or are so well entrenched that you won't have a prayer apart from the occasional private insurance or Medicaid referral (which no agency wants).

    If you're coming from pharma you might think that all those doctors you called on will just automatically start referring to you. Think again. If a doctor regularly refers to home health he'll either be on staff with an agency or has his preferred ones. If a doctor is not familiar with home health services you'll either get crappy referrals (i.e. "go check on this patient I haven't seen in two years") or they won't have the patience to learn who and how to refer.

    And don't count on help from your manager. They want people with existing contacts in the industry who can immediately refer. If they take a chance on someone new to the industry you'll get accounts who won't produce for you. If you don't produce right away you get railroaded out. Also, don't count on any type of training or mentoring. You will likely get pushed out into the field after a few ride-alongs. After that you're on your own.
  11. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Actaully heard new boss Dean say that he doesn't "buy it that good pharma reps were laid off". "What company would be so stupid to lay of their best people" if you are formere Pharma......your sales boss thinks you are a loser.....
  12. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Poster 10- so true.. I thought my docs would refer... lol... they ARE medical directors or do not want the bs paperwork. I am on 5th month... they want 10 referrals a month for a small hh in a very saturated market... I get close to 10.... then they break a hip... thought they were Medicare and they are Medicare replacement...or they refuse services... then I get the crap referrals that have one foot in the grave... need to go to a nursing home. I wonder why they can't give me patients BEFORE they get to that point. I just got screwed out of 2 referrals yesterday because they were discharges that came back on services... (a new start) and I did all the leg work... got all paperwork... talked with families. then my own company rearranges paperwork I think to purposely not give me the referral. I do think they want me gone.... it is so hard,.... we are no different than any other.

    Poster 11... I don't think performance has anything to do with a entire division being shut down. I was with a division of a large pharma that was laying off PCP, then our specialty division shut down. Kind of hard to speak "performance" when company is extinct!
  13. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    Ok...OP here.. so I made it 5 months.... then they "let me go"... first it was "performance" which is funny as I had no medical director, we had zero prescence.. I got the 10 referrals required (technically) but they either the patient refused, went to nursing home as "too sick" when nurse went out... or ....drum rolll.... they REFUSED referral due to STAFFING in my territory.. (ok... I have contract in my area... the other 2 reps have regular employees..) also may I state the other reps were not making the "10" required (we are smaller company) either even with medical directors and regular staffing. And both had been at company for 1.5 years....

    Hmmm... so then I find out they are closing my territory and not "rehiring". so how can that be perforamance? I am the 4TH rep they hired in a 1.5 year window... (yes... not kidding) and had I know it was the step child territory I would have NEVER taken it.

    Question... I will get a good reference (as they have told me... ) but... if they call home office and get "dates" of employment and ask if elgible for rehire (they local boss said she would give me good reference) can or would they be dumb enough to say I am not? I could pretend to be an employer I guess and find out. In this economy that would be the death nall. I didn't have a chance to be good... 5 months in Home Health with NO CONNECTIONs, NO MEDICAL DIRECTORS... closed hospitals (as they were too cheap to get me credentialed) I worked for another HH and did great... of course I had a good company with some connections. I would have stayed there but I got a 10K pay raise, more bonus potential at this one.

    I am floored. So unethical... I best get unemployment as I did find out FOR A FACT they decided not to keep my territory open and concentrate on one area only. If someone is 'better" than me... why not hire someone else? Also... kinda hard to compare me to other 2 reps who have medical directors.... nurses that work in hospitals (on the side) in their territories... and of course even with all that .... they did not meet their "quota" .... insight and not a place to be.............. unsettled by no job... grateful to be out of HH!
  14. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    What a former employer can release depends on the state. I live in California and the only two pieces of information a former employer can release are your title and the starting/ending dates of employment.

    I feel ya, though. I was let go from my home health company for performance issues as well. I was hired with no HH experience and put into a completely green territory. Not only that but my territory was changed three times in the year and a half I was there. I managed to put together a good month here and there but never got a chance to settle in any particular area.

    I also had the displeasure of working with an area manager who never did ride-alongs and whose attitude was "sink or swim". Asshole had ten years of experience in HH sales and didn't think it was his job as a manager to mentor, lend any expertise, or even attempt to help anyone who was struggling. Just a bad overall experience.
  15. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    well, op here. This is a little long so you may want to stop here. I am trying to save anyone who thinks this may be a cool job.(and you could be the exception... just saying ... read all the other posts.. you will see a trend)

    What I was indicating was the branch manager is so clueless... she did not know why I was let go. sHe never knew anything about our job (everytime I would ask questions it was.... I dunno....with NO
    attempt to find answers... she had zero medical experience! she came from the banking industry and always went to 3 hour lunches.... tells the staff she is out "marketing" (I thought that was my job???? and of course "she" never brought in a single referral for someone who was out 'marketing" daily.

    I found out that they are NOT rehiring and are going to concentrate on just one area... kinda hard to say "performance" huh? They would try to get another rep better than me. She really has no idea.

    People at branch will pass the buck at EVERY chance. Not being bitter...I am one of those "don't worry be happy people"... it is amazingly true. I know this as a few of my friends had the same EXACT experience almost to a T.

    Yes... very mean atmosphere... sink or swim... they expected 10 referrals 1st month (once again small company and that is good for our company) I got 8 first month... of course they had problems with staffing... or the office taking in the patients would do "negative starts" after 2 attempts to call patient and not tell us UNTIL we got 'negative start" email. At that point you have to literally start all over again and tell referral source. Then you have to send in demos (hopefully you saved them) and now they are mad as you were supposed to see patient 2 days ago and now its Friday and you can't see them until Wed. of next week. Not good. (and this is a pretty big HH company in one part of the country... just has small branches in different areas)

    I actually had one patient that was going to be started 14 (yes I am not kidding) days after referral. I ask office what is going on... oh, its okay don't worry they will start in 2 days... right.... then the referral source calls patient and they say... well, no nurse has called or come by.... doc or social worker switches them to another HH who CAN get there within 24 hours and ce le vie to my referral!

    The nurses would maybe attempt to call twice and if they couldn't reach patient (alot of patients don't answer phone with our company name on it) then THEY would negative start patient. I actually wound up driving to patients houses to reach them before negative starts. It was that ridiculous. OUr nurses did not understand that we have to have starts to keep their jobs. they just don't get it. I was even told by my 'manager" if you want to call it that, that the nurses were discharging patients at first sign of getting better as their 'patient load" was too high... they would cite patient "non-compliance" which would be something very minor... so census going down.

    My manager said she felt bad and will vouch for me. She admitted that they had put no time or resources in my area and it was so big I couldn't even concentrate on small areas as they DEMANDED I spread it out. No sense. Her boss was a shark... told me they expected quota every month from me.. no excuses.. but the other reps were getting 4 or 5 and they are still there. Oh, did I mention that one of the reps is the niece of the owner? Yes... its true. ... it really is an awful job, and awful experience.... they also screwed over my check (about$ 400 less than it should be and I have full 2 weeks in- that means they didn't reiumburse most of my expenses) and I called- they still have yet to send my paycheck stub and so I cannot see what they did.

    A really bad experience..... I am relieved to be gone but stressed to be out in a horrible economy. a word to the wise.................. unless you used to be a nurse in several different places.... or a social worker with connections..... or if your company has several medical directors in place.... (I would NEVER go to work with HH unless you have at least 2 good medical directors, and ask to see their actual referrals each month for the past year- they have this info) because if you do not you are screwed. I don't care who you knew at last HH company. The doctors or hospital is loyal to the company, NOT THE REP in most cases. If someone big like Amedysis has 6 medical directors in an area, don't think you can leave Amediysis and they medical directors will refer to YOU at your new company. NOT. They will refer to NEW Amedysis rep... as they are getting paid to do 'a conference" and get their "fee".

    If medical director at your new company brings in x number of referrals and you cannot continue that trend, then something is wrong with you. It really is the death nall unless you have some good doctor friends, who have a patient Medicare base to get referrals and they have not been scooped up yet by another HH.

    Sorry for being so longwinded. It is that bad of a job and if I can save one person from this nightmare I hope it helps. Doesn't matter if you were a superstar medical device or pharma rep. It just doesn't... good luck to all..............