Thoughts on Abilify from the front line?

Overheard Proteus people talking about Abilify and their 1st NDA, partner and investor Otsuka. They were fretting about how clueless Proteus senior management with constant waffling on strategies and feeling lucky that Otsuka chose to become the guinea pig as so many potential deals with other pharmas didn't materialize.

So from the front line - what are your opinion of this digital medicine stuff? Real or snake oil added to drug facing generic price pressure?

 

Personally I think it will be be something that is only used within clinical studies. I also dont think it solves a meaningful health problem as it will complicate a simple routine by adding extra layers of technologies, increasing medication costs and adding extra tasks for patients to do. If this ever gets launched then and only then will you and everyone know if it is snake oil or "real". Lets first see what the FDA thinks as this is their first major hurdle then it will be what the market really thinks when they launch.

 

it is hubris! the CEOs are playing their fiddles from the fourth floor. Next phase is incorporating virtual reality with bitcoins to the pills - ONLY at Otsuka!

 

Proteus are desperate to get a product to market so they consistently over promise and under deliver. They are learning on Otsuka's dime however Otsuka doesn't seem to mind because it believes it is going to change the world when in fact the world has already passed this technology bye (sic). I think the best phrase to use here is "nothing to see here, move along". Proteus tried with other pharma companies but nothing has come out of it. I assume the same here given that people in the tech and health industry don't care or pay almost no attention to what Proteus is doing anymore - "The boy who cried wolf"

 

Rumour has it that Proteus is running out of cold cash (typical for company in start-up mode for umpteen years) and desperate to sell itself to bagholder. Apparently some Chinese/Taiwanese company did some due diligence and left dodge as fast as they can. They resort to annual layoff routines before X-mas/Thanksgiving and so low on cash that hire army of low paid intern kids for pittance who couldn't land a job at SillyCON valley.

As for Abilify - c'mon guys we're talking about folks who are schizophrenic and asking them to swallow a pill with chip and bulky piece of crap on their body to monitor it via internet? Worst combo possible! What idiot at Otsuka signed up as Proteus guinea pig? Geesh no wonder host of pharmas did some cursory due diligence and ran away but Otsuka which says a lot about Otsuka...

 

I think Proteus is now valued around $1B however I know how the evaluation game is played, I give you $1MM and you give me 0.1% of the company so now we are at $1B eval, so we won't know what the true evaluation is until they do an ipo and release their initial two financial statements. From what i have read they have only had around $170MM in investments, I could be wrong, and I am certain that there would be milestones to meet to get all the money which means a flawless execution. I am not aware of any pharma company, other than Otsuka, that has been dumb enough to adopt the technology after some DD and/or testing.

 

<< “A company five years old can still be a startup,” writes Y Combinator accelerator head Paul Graham via email. “Ten [years old] would start to be a stretch.” >> given this definition from one of the most prominent and successful investor in the start up industry means that Proteus is anything but a start up. Over 15+ years in existence means they should be a mature company with positive cash flows but they have the opposite. Facebook is only 12 years old and they have a market cap of $333B (and growing). Proteus is what VCs call "The Walking Dead". It needs a shot to the head to put it out of its misery but Otsuka keeps feeding it.

 

POS-teus is dying "unicorn" in dire needs of cash infusions from suckers, and Otsuka took it hook, line and stinker (oops meant sinker). Wait till the Feds go to POS-teus for PAI and issue litany of observations to device company who is totally clueless especially on drug GMP. So Otsuka will have to pour more resources and shit load of money to POS-teus with army of consultants in the league of consent decree.

How do you say "sucker born every minute" in Japanese as Otsuka's shitty management will be turning Japanese - no pun intended for The Vapors.

 

Otsu and Pro-sham received CRL.

Wheels are coming off and next up is firing of the Otsu DD team and leadership. Pro-sham to last few more months as they raised 9th round of funding (series H) 10 days before CRL - they knew it was coming.

 

"Pro-sham" has been living on borrowed times for over 10 years. If you look at the big players in silicon valley you will see that they never mention Pro-sham or even their technology. It appears to be just large corporations with that are playing with shareholder money. Ingestible sensors can only detect that the sensor was swallowed. In can not detect if it was ingested with a drug but Otsuka refused to accept that. A person who wants to avoid taking drugs can get around any system including this one. The FDA isn't as naive as Proteus and Otsuka thought. Proteus just got a dose of reality and I am sure they will go on to be a successful "start up" for another 10 years and Otsuka can continue to fund them with no returns.

 

"We believe in the potential of this product to help people with serious mental illness manage their daily medication, which remains a serious unmet need...” total BS! this is all about trying to fill the Abilify patent loss gap by putting a chip in a pill and claiming it is an unmet need for people with serious mental issues. People with serious mental issues can not afford a cell phone, a data plan or a roof over their heads. I would be very surprised if they could properly understand how to use a complex system that requires an app, a bluetooth connection and a connection to the cloud and furthermore understand that upgrading the phone or OS could render the app unstable. The bluetooth connection for studies were forced on so users couldn't switch bluetooth off which means it does not reflect what happens in real world conditions. In the real world people do switch off bluetooth either directly or indirectly through another app. Also keep in mind the seriously mentally ill have to put on patches and wear them for several days and connect them to their phone, sound like a very difficult ask for such people. This is one product that has almost zero benefits for the seriously mentally ill patients but everything to do with making a profit. If Otsuka wants to help patients then let the patients have Abilify for the price of generics and give them a simple pill reminder app, which are free.

 

two desperate companies coming together to build something stupid.

 

Imagine a paranoid schizophrenic swallowing a device sensor so they can become even MORE paranoid. Really?! Can't wait for them to file more lawsuits against this STUPID, ARROGANT company.

 

We're supposed to know CNS - how could they not know this? Why wouldn't you start someplace else in mental illness? Duh!

 

welcome to the Billy and Bobby show. 5 days a week we bring you nothing but entertainment, variety and tap dancing.

 

Otsuka is at the forefront of innovation. Today you just take a pill but in the future Otsuka and Proteus will partner together to deliver a solution that will require you to buy a phone, buy patches, wear a patch, pair it to your phone, download an app, open the app, check your patch is properly paired, make sure you have a signal and a data plan and then you take your pill. If something goes wrong then you need to call your wireless provider, your phone manufacturer, Otsuka and Proteus assuming that you care enough or even sane enough to act. That's what I like about Otsuka innovation, it takes a simple problem and creates a complex and convoluted solution for the seriously mentally ill. Otsuka Innovation!

 

Innovation at Otsuka: solving the gasoline shortage problem with having everybody ride horses.

 

Well articulated! Alas if the folks suffering from schizophrenia can follow such convoluted steps... You forgot to mention the battery life on bulky wearable patch not to mention discomfort.

And will the payers pay more $$$ for this joke set-up or take the generic route (no doubt)?

 

As I thought for SZ when I heard. It is better suited for AD.

 

Any updates on the CRL Otsuka and idiots at Proteus got in late April 2016?


Those aholes at Proteus saw it coming and had galls to raise another $50 mil 10 days before CRL.