i know this is an obvious statement but i have to make it....this industry is a complete joke. if you have been doing it a long time it is a deterant to them hiring you. in every other profession experience is an asset, this industry is a complete waste of time. f u pharma.
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I went to a job fair a couple months ago, and Forest Pharmaceuticals was one of the firms there. Before you could check in with a recruiter, you had to check in with the organizer of the fair. They had a long spiel about conditions to see Forest (you had to get an okay from her before you could schedule). One of the specific conditions was less than 2 or 3 years experience in pharma sales.
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I went to a job fair a couple months ago, and Forest Pharmaceuticals was one of the firms there. Before you could check in with a recruiter, you had to check in with the organizer of the fair. They had a long spiel about conditions to see Forest (you had to get an okay from her before you could schedule). One of the specific conditions was less than 2 or 3 years experience in pharma sales.
this was specifically the company i was talking about, although i know others are doing the same thing. they are ridic. these companies and this job will never have any reputability. This is the only industry in the world where experience does not qualify you for a job. Disgraceful. If you don't want people who really know what their doing and always want to hire 20 somethings running around in short skirts or meat heads, this job will always be looked at in a bad light. I am doing what I should have a long time ago....breaking free.
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this was specifically the company i was talking about, although i know others are doing the same thing. they are ridic. these companies and this job will never have any reputability. This is the only industry in the world where experience does not qualify you for a job. Disgraceful. If you don't want people who really know what their* doing and always want to hire 20 somethings running around in short skirts or meat heads, this job will always be looked at in a bad light. I am doing what I should have a long time ago....breaking free.
*they are doing --wrong sp.
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i know this is an obvious statement but i have to make it....this industry is a complete joke. if you have been doing it a long time it is a deterant to them hiring you. in every other profession experience is an asset, this industry is a complete waste of time. f u pharma.
Not necessarily true. Experience matters in many of the high specialties. What you are confusing is tenure with experience. For instance most oncology companies will hire a rep with 3 years of oncology experience but only six overall years of pharma experience versus a PC rep with 10 years of PC experience. The problem is most PC/Big Pharma/Mass Market reps have tenure with very little experience outside of PC. It matters where you are at, and what you want to do. I never wanted to be a manager or home office person so I climbed the specialty ladder. I went from Big Pharma PC right out of college, did that for four years and then went to Amgen to sell GCSF during one of their expansions, which gave me access to calling on oncologists. I did that for three years, got my rolodex filled with oncology contacts and then went to Genentech. In a short amount of time my base salary went from $45K right out of college to $115K seven years later, and now at 39 I have a $140K base at a very attractive oncology biotech. And I have had the luck of hitting a few stock options/ESPP’s on the way at Amgen and Genentech.
It is how you want to play the game. I knew back in 1995 that mass market Big Pharma was a joke job and a dying business model. If you couldn’t figure out that having 5 reps in a POD selling the same drug to the same customer was a flawed idea than you deserve to be stuck in primary care mass market. I worked hard and had a plan to get to a specialty biotech. Too many of my peers stayed in big pharma never getting out of the PC/IM world and now they are stuck or laid off or are PC DM making 10% more than their reps with no upward mobility. If you are in your 30’s and are in PC/Mass Market you are stuck. I hate to say it but unless you have a good friend to bring you to their company you are almost un-hirable. For those of you in your 20’s there is still hope in this industry you just have to get out of the PC mentality, network yourself, and get to a small specialty biotech. Sure there are less of those jobs so only the connected and best will get there but it is there and it is no longer of a shot than jumping from PC to device or equipment because those folks don’t want you either.
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i understand what you are sayng and don't necessarily disagree. however my life did not map out in a straight line. i have had to move geographically 3x in the past seven years for my husbands career and the job market was tighter and tighter with each move, not leaving a lot of options.what i find frustrating is i have 15 years of solid sales experience alot of it in specialty and now noone wants to hire me, i cannot even get interviews. in any other industry or profession years of experience usually mean you know how to do a job and are good at it, which i am, but not in pharm. if you are a lawyer for 15 years noone would look at you like you have wasted 15 years of working in that profession basically for nothing and that is the case with this job. it is sad and these companies have and will continue to reap what they sow. i am looking at other areas to work in besides medical or pharm out of necessity, but also because its a tired industry
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i understand what you are sayng and don't necessarily disagree. however my life did not map out in a straight line. i have had to move geographically 3x in the past seven years for my husbands career and the job market was tighter and tighter with each move, not leaving a lot of options.what i find frustrating is i have 15 years of solid sales experience alot of it in specialty and now noone wants to hire me, i cannot even get interviews. in any other industry or profession years of experience usually mean you know how to do a job and are good at it, which i am, but not in pharm. if you are a lawyer for 15 years noone would look at you like you have wasted 15 years of working in that profession basically for nothing and that is the case with this job. it is sad and these companies have and will continue to reap what they sow. i am looking at other areas to work in besides medical or pharm out of necessity, but also because its a tired industry
It's not that your experience does not have value. It has more to do with supply and demand. There are far too many experienced mass market reps than there are jobs which drives down the salaries. In turn they would rather pay less money for less experience.
Also this is in no way unique to Pharma. To use yor lawyer example; if you went to a mediocre law school and the only job u could get was as an government prosecuter and you did that for 5 years the likelihood of you becoming a partner at a major lawfirm is very small. There are many businesses that are "young people's" business were you have to climb the ladder early and quickly. Financial service comes to mind. Unfortunately that was not conducive to your lifestyle, which is not the fault of or unique to this or any industry.
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It's not that your experience does not have value. It has more to do with supply and demand. There are far too many experienced mass market reps than there are jobs which drives down the salaries. In turn they would rather pay less money for less experience.
Also this is in no way unique to Pharma. To use yor lawyer example; if you went to a mediocre law school and the only job u could get was as an government prosecuter and you did that for 5 years the likelihood of you becoming a partner at a major lawfirm is very small. There are many businesses that are "young people's" business were you have to climb the ladder early and quickly. Financial service comes to mind. Unfortunately that was not conducive to your lifestyle, which is not the fault of or unique to this or any industry.
the school you went to means nothing, its all who you know in this world.
the network may be stronger at these schools, and that is the value.
still, there are lawyers from average to below average firms that get hired over the top tier schools because they are easier to work with.
ivy dorks do good because they know people, not because they are smarter. in fact, most of these types are terrible in the work place because they think they know it all.
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the school you went to means nothing, its all who you know in this world.
the network may be stronger at these schools, and that is the value.
still, there are lawyers from average to below average firms that get hired over the top tier schools because they are easier to work with.
ivy dorks do good because they know people, not because they are smarter. in fact, most of these types are terrible in the work place because they think they know it all.
Ah the bitter state school’er trying to justify his worthless degree…Go back to doing your sample inventory…
Wrong on all counts by the way. Look at the placement for the top tier law schools versus the middle and lower tier. It is undeniable. Sure there are always exceptions and I’m not saying all top tier’ers become successful and all lower tier’er are mediocre but if you average it all out there is a reason top tier graduates get the better jobs and make more money. Connections help but it’s is hardly the governing factor…
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Ah the bitter state school’er trying to justify his worthless degree…Go back to doing your sample inventory…
Wrong on all counts by the way. Look at the placement for the top tier law schools versus the middle and lower tier. It is undeniable. Sure there are always exceptions and I’m not saying all top tier’ers become successful and all lower tier’er are mediocre but if you average it all out there is a reason top tier graduates get the better jobs and make more money. Connections help but it’s is hardly the governing factor…
went to a top private school, so you don't know what you are talking about.
And, I paid for it, not my parents, like you.
And, my friends are lawyers from "average" law schools, that often reject ivy candidates because: a. they think their shit doesn't stink and b. they lack interpersonal skills.
you are hopefully in your 20s to be this stupid.
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went to a top private school, so you don't know what you are talking about.
And, I paid for it, not my parents, like you.
And, my friends are lawyers from "average" law schools, that often reject ivy candidates because: a. they think their shit doesn't stink and b. they lack interpersonal skills.
you are hopefully in your 20s to be this stupid.
Sure...
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Sure...
Sure, you are an idiot.
Silver spoon in your mouth your entire life, right?
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Sure, you are an idiot.
Silver spoon in your mouth your entire life, right?
Yawn...
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Yawn...
Nice contribution, idiot.
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Sure, you are an idiot.
Silver spoon in your mouth your entire life, right?
Ya got me. More like a Platinum Spoon. Yes, Jeeves would brush our teeth for us each morning and drive us to school in the Bentley. I merely do this job as a way to mingle with the common people and have the appearance of being a “hard worker”.
How about you? Let me guess…trailer park? How noble!
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Ya got me. More like a Platinum Spoon. Yes, Jeeves would brush our teeth for us each morning and drive us to school in the Bentley. I merely do this job as a way to mingle with the common people and have the appearance of being a “hard worker”.
How about you? Let me guess…trailer park? How noble!
face the facts: you got your bluff called and you can't handle the truth.
Now, go back to mom's basement and stay there.
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face the facts: you got your bluff called and you can't handle the truth.
Now, go back to mom's basement and stay there.
Once again you caught me! You're right I CAN'T handle the truth and my bluff HAS been called! Knowing I still live in my Mother's basement and telling me to go there AND stay there...Pure Genius! I have been bested old chap! Well played!
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Ah the bitter state school’er trying to justify his worthless degree…Go back to doing your sample inventory…
Wrong on all counts by the way. Look at the placement for the top tier law schools versus the middle and lower tier. It is undeniable. Sure there are always exceptions and I’m not saying all top tier’ers become successful and all lower tier’er are mediocre but if you average it all out there is a reason top tier graduates get the better jobs and make more money. Connections help but it’s is hardly the governing factor…
Went to 2 very good private schools on the East Coast, and you don't know much about what is going on with college education today, do you?
a. college degrees are becoming more and more worthless, as more people are getting them with greater ease as well.
b. the economy sucks, so your degree doesn't have value right now.
c. college, especially in the private schools (I graduated about 15 years ago and the price was reasonable, even for a private school), is way over-valued, when you consider the cost of attendance and the payoff when graduating (bad payoff considering the terrible job market).
d. you are clueless, because you have probably not had too much adversity in your life, so grow up.