DUI...should I even try?

Quote

Anonymous said:
No anger man. There is no "cafemedicaldevice" so I come on here.

Failure in the industry I fully admit. But my failure in pharma meant success in device, making much more money than you. Honestly, I make more money than most pharma DMs...so when you aspire to get promoted in pharma, understand that I still make more money than you would.

Bottomline, if you are so good at sales, come sell alongside me in medical device. I'd be happy to bring you on as an associate. You sound like a pharma superstar, which means you would be fantastic in selling a medical device...*cough*.
Click to expand...

This was my post and it is cool to see someone defending me on here. LOL.

(See post above this about the guy who hires people.)

I went to the Doctor's office with my wife a few days ago and while sitting in the waiting room I noticed a few drug reps walking around...All VERY good looking women. And all completely vapid looking..high heels, pushed up tits, bleached blond hair, etc...

I even listen to the sales pitches while I am talking to a Dr about signing for an expensive device and the complete and utter lack of sales ability makes me cringe...Conversations like:

"Hey Doctor, how is your family? Love your tie. How is Billy doing in teeball this year? Did you have a chance to read that study yet? No? Well, will you write Fuckitall 3mg for every one of your patients?"

HUH?

I cringe because I hope to God that is not how I am viewed selling my device. My conversations are centered on the FABs of the device and the understanding that this Doctor will probably not see me again for 5 years. No sense in developing a meaningless relationship with a Doctor when he wants what I sell and I sell it at a good price.

It is like when I bought I car. It was a one transaction sale. This guy selling the car knew I wouldn't be back for years...

I have seen some drug reps really hustle it. I tried. Those hustlers tend to get out and sell device or move onto something better.
 


Anonymous said:
This was my post and it is cool to see someone defending me on here. LOL.

(See post above this about the guy who hires people.)

I went to the Doctor's office with my wife a few days ago and while sitting in the waiting room I noticed a few drug reps walking around...All VERY good looking women. And all completely vapid looking..high heels, pushed up tits, bleached blond hair, etc...

I even listen to the sales pitches while I am talking to a Dr about signing for an expensive device and the complete and utter lack of sales ability makes me cringe...Conversations like:

"Hey Doctor, how is your family? Love your tie. How is Billy doing in teeball this year? Did you have a chance to read that study yet? No? Well, will you write Fuckitall 3mg for every one of your patients?"

HUH?

I cringe because I hope to God that is not how I am viewed selling my device. My conversations are centered on the FABs of the device and the understanding that this Doctor will probably not see me again for 5 years. No sense in developing a meaningless relationship with a Doctor when he wants what I sell and I sell it at a good price.

It is like when I bought I car. It was a one transaction sale. This guy selling the car knew I wouldn't be back for years...

I have seen some drug reps really hustle it. I tried. Those hustlers tend to get out and sell device or move onto something better.
Click to expand...

totally agree. I quit after about 2 years, and moved on. But, went back after the pay was too good.

Now, I am ready to get out again, as this job is just not for ambitous people.

Its too bad the economy stinks right now for me to find something worthwhile.

Pharma is really left over for the bimbos and men who can play the corporate game with no guts.

I have guts, and I don't fit in. I know that. But, there really are not better jobs right now.
 


OK I'm one of the defenders of medsales guy - not in med sales-ex pharma - do have b2b (4 some reason can't get device to look at me but do have a b2b opp coming up) however, I digress. What the pharma people won't admit - even though it is so obvious - is they are marketers/lobbyists at best. Now I know some management types or over-inflated ego'd out reps will disagree but the proof is in the pudding. The Metric to measure pharma performance (at least in big pharma) is reach & frequency. Have to have that reach & frequency. R&F are advertising terms! Will my brand/product message be delivered to the customers that will benefit (thats Reach) 'Yes Mr. Brand manager, if u advertise on our station Nielson data show that more 35-45 females r watching at x time... (In pharma this is called your target list) Frequency is how many times the intended demo hears the message - your call plan. The stick to ensure frequency and reach is having to is the PDMA rule req. witness the doctor sign for samples (which btw is not part of the PDMA regs). If u don't have r&f, and to many no-signs your on a PIP.

If you were really in sales you would be comped on orders shipped from wholesalers to pharmacies that are shipped into your zip codes! Do you think Canon cares if their AE's witness the contract being signed! Hell fax it over! In pharma can you contol who you see, well Mr. DM Dr. HighDecile will only sign for samples and wont see me so I quit calling on him... WHAT!!!. But thats exactly what a sales rep would do, its called PROSPECTING. If you actually ran your own business would you continue to buy lunches for someone's staff who tries to avoid you at all costs! Would you continue to call on someone and give them free samples who is simply not using your product - of course not.

Bottom line is pharma is evaluated primarily on marketing/advertising metrics so therefore that's what it is. Sales are based on goods purchased, at the end of the day all device or b2b want is to know how many orders are being shipped to customers, not about R&F. And the docs are hip now to the scam that pharma has become which is why access has dropped, as my first b2b sales manager said ' you have to bring something of value to the customer- a reason to be there' when you walk in the door' pharma's not doing that - they bring bagels
 


Anonymous said:
OK I'm one of the defenders of medsales guy - not in med sales-ex pharma - do have b2b (4 some reason can't get device to look at me but do have a b2b opp coming up) however, I digress. What the pharma people won't admit - even though it is so obvious - is they are marketers/lobbyists at best. Now I know some management types or over-inflated ego'd out reps will disagree but the proof is in the pudding. The Metric to measure pharma performance (at least in big pharma) is reach & frequency. Have to have that reach & frequency. R&F are advertising terms! Will my brand/product message be delivered to the customers that will benefit (thats Reach) 'Yes Mr. Brand manager, if u advertise on our station Nielson data show that more 35-45 females r watching at x time... (In pharma this is called your target list) Frequency is how many times the intended demo hears the message - your call plan. The stick to ensure frequency and reach is having to is the PDMA rule req. witness the doctor sign for samples (which btw is not part of the PDMA regs). If u don't have r&f, and to many no-signs your on a PIP.

If you were really in sales you would be comped on orders shipped from wholesalers to pharmacies that are shipped into your zip codes! Do you think Canon cares if their AE's witness the contract being signed! Hell fax it over! In pharma can you contol who you see, well Mr. DM Dr. HighDecile will only sign for samples and wont see me so I quit calling on him... WHAT!!!. But thats exactly what a sales rep would do, its called PROSPECTING. If you actually ran your own business would you continue to buy lunches for someone's staff who tries to avoid you at all costs! Would you continue to call on someone and give them free samples who is simply not using your product - of course not.

Bottom line is pharma is evaluated primarily on marketing/advertising metrics so therefore that's what it is. Sales are based on goods purchased, at the end of the day all device or b2b want is to know how many orders are being shipped to customers, not about R&F. And the docs are hip now to the scam that pharma has become which is why access has dropped, as my first b2b sales manager said ' you have to bring something of value to the customer- a reason to be there' when you walk in the door' pharma's not doing that - they bring bagels
Click to expand...

exactly correct.

to give credit to drug reps, they do make good money. So, you can't totally blame them for not taking these jobs.

Sales, true sales is a tough job. Medical device is not really a big selling job either, because these healthcare providers need these machines, and the devices are often going to be bought regardless of the salesperson.

I always though food sales was the toughest sales job out there.
 


Anonymous said:
OK I'm one of the defenders of medsales guy - not in med sales-ex pharma - do have b2b (4 some reason can't get device to look at me but do have a b2b opp coming up) however, I digress. What the pharma people won't admit - even though it is so obvious - is they are marketers/lobbyists at best. Now I know some management types or over-inflated ego'd out reps will disagree but the proof is in the pudding. The Metric to measure pharma performance (at least in big pharma) is reach & frequency. Have to have that reach & frequency. R&F are advertising terms! Will my brand/product message be delivered to the customers that will benefit (thats Reach) 'Yes Mr. Brand manager, if u advertise on our station Nielson data show that more 35-45 females r watching at x time... (In pharma this is called your target list) Frequency is how many times the intended demo hears the message - your call plan. The stick to ensure frequency and reach is having to is the PDMA rule req. witness the doctor sign for samples (which btw is not part of the PDMA regs). If u don't have r&f, and to many no-signs your on a PIP.

If you were really in sales you would be comped on orders shipped from wholesalers to pharmacies that are shipped into your zip codes! Do you think Canon cares if their AE's witness the contract being signed! Hell fax it over! In pharma can you contol who you see, well Mr. DM Dr. HighDecile will only sign for samples and wont see me so I quit calling on him... WHAT!!!. But thats exactly what a sales rep would do, its called PROSPECTING. If you actually ran your own business would you continue to buy lunches for someone's staff who tries to avoid you at all costs! Would you continue to call on someone and give them free samples who is simply not using your product - of course not.

Bottom line is pharma is evaluated primarily on marketing/advertising metrics so therefore that's what it is. Sales are based on goods purchased, at the end of the day all device or b2b want is to know how many orders are being shipped to customers, not about R&F. And the docs are hip now to the scam that pharma has become which is why access has dropped, as my first b2b sales manager said ' you have to bring something of value to the customer- a reason to be there' when you walk in the door' pharma's not doing that - they bring bagels
Click to expand...

Meddevice guy here...Damn! That is the best explanation i have EVER seen on CP. Seriously, well put with good analysis and the understanding of the industry.
 


Anonymous said:
OK I'm one of the defenders of medsales guy - not in med sales-ex pharma - do have b2b (4 some reason can't get device to look at me but do have a b2b opp coming up) however, I digress. What the pharma people won't admit - even though it is so obvious - is they are marketers/lobbyists at best. Now I know some management types or over-inflated ego'd out reps will disagree but the proof is in the pudding. The Metric to measure pharma performance (at least in big pharma) is reach & frequency. Have to have that reach & frequency. R&F are advertising terms! Will my brand/product message be delivered to the customers that will benefit (thats Reach) 'Yes Mr. Brand manager, if u advertise on our station Nielson data show that more 35-45 females r watching at x time... (In pharma this is called your target list) Frequency is how many times the intended demo hears the message - your call plan. The stick to ensure frequency and reach is having to is the PDMA rule req. witness the doctor sign for samples (which btw is not part of the PDMA regs). If u don't have r&f, and to many no-signs your on a PIP.

If you were really in sales you would be comped on orders shipped from wholesalers to pharmacies that are shipped into your zip codes! Do you think Canon cares if their AE's witness the contract being signed! Hell fax it over! In pharma can you contol who you see, well Mr. DM Dr. HighDecile will only sign for samples and wont see me so I quit calling on him... WHAT!!!. But thats exactly what a sales rep would do, its called PROSPECTING. If you actually ran your own business would you continue to buy lunches for someone's staff who tries to avoid you at all costs! Would you continue to call on someone and give them free samples who is simply not using your product - of course not.

Bottom line is pharma is evaluated primarily on marketing/advertising metrics so therefore that's what it is. Sales are based on goods purchased, at the end of the day all device or b2b want is to know how many orders are being shipped to customers, not about R&F. And the docs are hip now to the scam that pharma has become which is why access has dropped, as my first b2b sales manager said ' you have to bring something of value to the customer- a reason to be there' when you walk in the door' pharma's not doing that - they bring bagels
Click to expand...

Don't know who you work for but the 3 companies I've been at in over 20 years have ALWAYS measures my performance on prescriptions-NEVER on R&F.
It's obvious you are the teethytallturd. I don't think you have a clue about the pharma or device industry. You're just a troll aren't you? You can't really be this ignorant.
 


Anonymous said:
Meddevice guy here...Damn! That is the best explanation i have EVER seen on CP. Seriously, well put with good analysis and the understanding of the industry.
Click to expand...

Fool-you wrote that...It's very easy to pick out your writing!!! Just adding -'s and...'s and !!! doesn't change your boring monologues and ignorance of the industry.
 


Anonymous said:
Don't know who you work for but the 3 companies I've been at in over 20 years have ALWAYS measures my performance on prescriptions-NEVER on R&F.
It's obvious you are the teethytallturd. I don't think you have a clue about the pharma or device industry. You're just a troll aren't you? You can't really be this ignorant.
Click to expand...

Reach and frequency is measured at most companies. I had to do a checklist at the two companies I worked for on a weekly basis. YEs the RXs were measured as the biggest chunk but so was R/F because their mindset was that R/F would drive business.

20 years in pharma? So you are the old guy in pharma at the Sales Meetings who people think you are a VP, but you are a rep...Yup, we all know the type.
 


Anonymous said:
Reach and frequency is measured at most companies. I had to do a checklist at the two companies I worked for on a weekly basis. YEs the RXs were measured as the biggest chunk but so was R/F because their mindset was that R/F would drive business.

20 years in pharma? So you are the old guy in pharma at the Sales Meetings who people think you are a VP, but you are a rep...Yup, we all know the type.
Click to expand...

Well let me just toss this out there for u to chew on (2 the 20 year vet et. al.).

If I sell a copier (for example) to Wal-mart it gets counted as part of my 'numbers'. If you sell a doctor in a rural area where 80% of the people go to WalMart for a prescription on writing Metoo XR you get squat counted towards your 'numbers' because Wal-Mart doesn't report to IMS. Well actually IMS will triangulate the numbers to approximate what they think it should be. Don't think I ever hear of Pitney Bowes doing that (since all u pharma DM's like that PB experience fig'd I would give u something that resonates) IMS is about 70% accurate (at best) in describing what really goes in your territory for the 'numbers' that u live and die by.

Here's something else to think about. The Overtime lawsuits against Pfizer? etc. or whatever big pharma co. were decided in the plaintiffs favor. Managment argued that these were 'professional sales people' and were exempt from OT. The court ruled that the plaintiffs did not have sufficient autonomy in their day-day activities, i.e had to follow scripted presentations, could NOT make autonomous decisions on who to call on and who not to based on their business judgement/knowledge of territory, could not add potential new prospects to their plan directives etc., and as such should not be considered autonomous sales people buty non-exempt employes who deserve OT.

One final example, I'm selling insurance I make a presentation to Joe - he really likes what I have to say and agrees but feels he doesn't need the service at this time - however Saturday on the golf course he tells his friend Bob about my product - Bob calls me and I make money, i.e. referral. Pharma rep tells Dr. Joe Highdecile about his great product, Dr. Joe loves the idea tries it and finds its not covered on his pts plans so he can't rx, HOWEVER he tells Dr. Bob at the country club about this great new product, Dr. Bobs patients have coverage and Dr. Bob starts writing shitloads ofMetoo XR - Wholesalers are selling tons to local pharmacies - sadly Dr. Bob is not on your call plan and since he's not a GP and you can only call on GP's you can't add him. So how much does Mr./Ms. pharma rep make? However your company dictates by the R&F that u continue to call on AND sample Dr. Joe. Make sense? It doesn't does it. Unless your in the upside down world of pharma sales!

Obviously numbers get evaluated and u get bonused on that. The point is so much of that is out of ur control and is inaccurate and secondly unless u have really stellar numbers most pharma managment would hang u out to dry for deviating from the plan/making your own. Pharma reps are lobbyists plain and simple, unfortunately as the recent issue of Money "What to do with your $$ in 2012" the pharma sector ranked in the top 5 industries for job loss @ 20,000. Pretty easy to figure out why.
 


I'm done with you after this toothyboy.

Companies can buy the data for Walmart-mine does

I don't really care about your definition of REAL SALES-Doctors, pharmacists, teachers, parents, lawyers, and drug reps are all REAL SALES PEOPLE-You can either sell or you can't-PERIOD! And the OT cases are a fucking embarrassment-scum lawyers fucking up the country as usual

At my compnay I have full autonomy to add or remove doctors as I see fit, or to not call on a doctor if I don't want to, or to only call on a doctor once a year. I get a monthly report with dozens of columns of data, only 2 of them deal with r&f-no one cares.
I'm responsible for my SALES not how many docs I see or sample

There are plenty of companies like mine out there who don't have to baby sit because they hire REAL SALES PEOPLE-

You're living in a small, childish world.
You're a bitter, broken person who needs to move one.

Like I said, I'm done with you,
 


Anonymous said:
I'm done with you after this toothyboy.

Companies can buy the data for Walmart-mine does

I don't really care about your definition of REAL SALES-Doctors, pharmacists, teachers, parents, lawyers, and drug reps are all REAL SALES PEOPLE-You can either sell or you can't-PERIOD! And the OT cases are a fucking embarrassment-scum lawyers fucking up the country as usual

At my compnay I have full autonomy to add or remove doctors as I see fit, or to not call on a doctor if I don't want to, or to only call on a doctor once a year. I get a monthly report with dozens of columns of data, only 2 of them deal with r&f-no one cares.
I'm responsible for my SALES not how many docs I see or sample

There are plenty of companies like mine out there who don't have to baby sit because they hire REAL SALES PEOPLE-

You're living in a small, childish world.
You're a bitter, broken person who needs to move one.

Like I said, I'm done with you,
Click to expand...

You'll be back. LOL.

You know what is funny you are honestly talking to more than one person here buddy. I am not the guy with the long winded posts.

To the other guy, I think we really drove this guy nuts.
 


Anonymous said:
You'll be back. LOL.

You know what is funny you are honestly talking to more than one person here buddy. I am not the guy with the long winded posts.

To the other guy, I think we really drove this guy nuts.
Click to expand...

Yeah, Probably wasn't to long of a drive! Apparently everyone in his large, adult, world must agree with him on everything or then they become broken and sent to the small childish world!
 


Anonymous said:
I'm done with you after this toothyboy.

Companies can buy the data for Walmart-mine does

I don't really care about your definition of REAL SALES-Doctors, pharmacists, teachers, parents, lawyers, and drug reps are all REAL SALES PEOPLE-You can either sell or you can't-PERIOD! And the OT cases are a fucking embarrassment-scum lawyers fucking up the country as usual

At my compnay I have full autonomy to add or remove doctors as I see fit, or to not call on a doctor if I don't want to, or to only call on a doctor once a year. I get a monthly report with dozens of columns of data, only 2 of them deal with r&f-no one cares.
I'm responsible for my SALES not how many docs I see or sample

There are plenty of companies like mine out there who don't have to baby sit because they hire REAL SALES PEOPLE-

You're living in a small, childish world.
You're a bitter, broken person who needs to move one.

Like I said, I'm done with you,
Click to expand...

When have you taken and placed an order from a customer in pharmaceutical "sales"?
 


You can be hired after 5 years with no problem as long as you have mo other points! That is the topic of this thread I thought. It is impossible in some states to get it expunged no matter h much you are willing to pay. It is on ones records in some states forever,i
 


As the other poster stated, YES, one can be hired with a D.U.I as long as it has been 5 years and you have no other points on your record. So, don't give up. Don't get another one. We all make bad choices. Learn from it. I know of 3 friends who were hired by different companies--the rules from HR are almost the same at least 5 years.
 


AZspecial said:
I am a recent college grad and got a DUI two years ago. I was considering getting into pharma/medical/vet sales (after I gain a little more sales experience) but the more and more I reasearch, I realize this that this career may not be a reality for me.

It was a stupid, seirous mistake that has had tremendous effects on my career choices. Does anyone have any advice on similar companies that would hire with dui on a record? I am at a complete loss about what steps to take next.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Click to expand...
 



Write your reply...
Top Bottom
Back
Quote